Episode 64: TVD’s The Ties That Bind

Episode 64

Spoiler Chat: 12:18.187-22:34.844

Quotes of the Podcast: “Then he finds the coffins, and the witches give him an aneurysm after he calls their place a squalor. I’m like, they were murdered there by racist White people, you twat.”

“And then Klaus says, you know, a hundred witches means thousands of descendants, and he’ll find them all. And I’m like, Klaus, how can you find and kill thousands of descendants when you can’t even find four coffins? And now you can’t find one coffin. Your ability to search leaves a lot to be desired.”

The Good: Bonnie and Abby! Elijah’s back!!!

The Bad: Forwood, and the show pulls logic out of Bill’s butt. Alaric/Meredith/Damon, and I wonder how bad a doctor Meredith was that she had so many patients dying on her. Stelena (all of their scenes are bad on rewatch). Stefan.

The Ugly: Bonnie kowtowing to Stefan and his rank attitude. Elena’s strength is acknowledged, but Bonnie being strong is written into her DNA so no special attention ever needs to be paid when she achieves a feat.  After outright forgetting that Stefan hurt Elena last episode, I wonder how I can make it to season 5 and still care when the show messes up her pov wrt being hurt by the Salvatores.

Discussion Post 1

Discussion Post 2

Joseph Morgan Interview

Episode 14 Synopsis

Episode 15 Synopsis

Character has been cast

Robert Ri’chard Interview

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20 thoughts on “Episode 64: TVD’s The Ties That Bind

  1. I’ve read the meta and I could really relate to the bit about Tyler being a descendant of native people. It could be and it has been pulling my chain ever since “Masquerade”. Add to it that Michael Trevino is also and decedent of native people makes me side eye his characters progression (or lack there of).

    Hell yes. This is the reason I wanted Bonnie/Tyler, because I wanted to hear their stories and how they relate to this vampire problem and how it could correlates to how POC’s (IRL) have to deal in the “White Man’s World”. Oh Hell Yes, I went there!

    Tyler looks white (and MT can pass apparently) but he still carries the curse of his people. Now Werewolf-ism is passed down through the generations. It’s genetic. So why we see so many (well mostly) white looking werewolves, peppered with some Black werewolves needs to be addressed. I feel like these werewolf descendants ends are a product of rape. And I feel like the Lockwoods have been passing or trying to pass for a long time but they still have this curse that follows them around, giving them away.

    Also this calls back to the Vampire/Werewolf relationship and the racial parallels it holds. For some reason vampires are a werewolves natural prey, and since this show claims that vikings discovered the ameraicas 🙄 and that they were also the the original vampires (i.e. first). It could stand to reason that the Indigenous Shamans may have created Werewolves as a natural defense against these invaders. Flawed as it was (cause they only turned on the full moon …) it shows that the native people had their own magics/culture/defenses/land before the invaders showed up and ripped it away.

    I really want to know more about his curse. I really want to know more about the people who came before. cause really it’s more interesting than what I’ve got to be put through right now with this show and it’s basic ass story lines that are rank and stank for its over use.

    I’ll bbl to review the podcast. I just have a lot of feeling and it’s hard for me to communicate them fluently. Gurl y’all make it look easy. 😕

    • So why we see so many (well mostly) white looking werewolves, peppered with some Black werewolves needs to be addressed.

      This assumes that the Americas are the only place that had werewolves, that they didn’t exist in Europe. I think Tyler’s connections to the indigenous peoples is way too vague to have a case. Even in 1864, the Lockwoods were White as can be.

      It could stand to reason that the Indigenous Shamans may have created Werewolves as a natural defense against these invaders. Flawed as it was (cause they only turned on the full moon …) it shows that the native people had their own magics/culture/defenses/land before the invaders showed up and ripped it away.

      The werewolves existed before Mikael and his family came over, so I don’t think a shaman created them for protection. Was it Elijah who said werewolves were way older than vampires or was it Rebekah? I have no idea why there wouldn’t be werewolves in Europe, but the producers wanted their vikings in North America. Ugh.

      • This assumes that the Americas are the only place that had werewolves, that they didn’t exist in Europe. I think Tyler’s connections to the indigenous peoples is way too vague to have a case. Even in 1864, the Lockwoods were White as can be.

        Maybe I want it too bad. But if I have to I can explain that way as well … This show likes so say that vampires are only 1000 years old and made in America … How long were the Lockwood’s there before they stared building stealing a community? there could have been some mixing …

        I definitely want it too bad. 😦

        IDK how this show works, maybe … I’m tired of making up reasons for things and trying to rationalize this show and all it’s screw ups …

        Is it just a coincidence that a werewolf bite kills a vampire? Werewolves were around way before vampires but maybe (ugh) someone made it so their bite could kill a vampire. Or maybe that was just a bonus I don’t know.

        This show is … draining me. 😦

        • The show completely dropped the werewolf/vampire rivalry. That was only relevant when Mason was alive, which is why he shouldn’t have been killed so soon. I remember when I wanted to know what was it about a vamp’s bite that killed vampires and whether vampires had any natural poisons that could hurt the werewolves. That’s also why, if I think about it too long, the Hybrids should never have been a success. Because I wouldn’t think werewolf blood would react badly to a vampire’s blood.

          • That’s also why, if I think about it too long, the Hybrids should never have been a success. Because I wouldn’t think werewolf blood would react badly to a vampire’s blood.

            Thank you! I want a witch to cultivate something from the saliva from a werewolf/hybrid. Something in Elena’s Blood Cures it all! *crying blood tears*

  2. I’m really enjoying this podcast, legitimately cackling in the office.

    I’m gonna need this show to get it’s priorities right.

    Or can I just get a damn spin-off with these witches.

    Also, what is a goddamn Stefan? He is so annoying, it hurts my head. And it’s not because I don’t understand why he’s being like that – it’s, as you said, why the hell is Bonnie not allowed to throw him into a wall to get his ass to shut up?

    I’ll be back to say something useful later.

    • Or can I just get a damn spin-off with these witches.

      This will never not be a pertinent wish. *Sigh.* TVD witches. Forever more interesting than any other TVD creature.

      Yes! Like I said, the reason asshole Stefan was so enjoyable last episode is because you had everyone he was being an asshole to say something back to him, most important being Elena.

  3. Warning: I wrote an essay

    “the ugliest duckling that’s ever been ugly.” Oh bonnie. *hugs*

    Klaus’s love life … why?

    Caroline is the first because Klaus has never turned anyone … as far as we know.

    We know who’s in the 4th coffin. didn’t they say we didn’t know who was in the coffin or something?

    Spoilers:

    It’s gonna be BONNIE! lol I almost threw up.

    Bonnie got invited but she threw that shit in the trash … too bad it’s not a ploy for Klaus to get everyone away from Bonnie so he can kidnap her since she is the most powerful.

    Just Wait Alta, maybe Grams will come back. 😀

    Meridith and her BF didn’t even register …

    Caroline being seduced by “the big bad”

    I didn’t know that the show was all … JP. She is a racist … that’s all I’m going to say about that. Where was she born? I can’t find any info.

    I love the tag too.

    I love that Abby told her story and I can see where she’s coming from.

    Why was Elena there? Bonnie wasn’t there when Elena was meeting her mother. whatever

    Abby wanted to get rid of one more danger.

    1. THANK YOU
    2. Retcon. Michael needed to know about the Doppelganger so that Elena could start talking during Bonnie/Abby’s moments

    Alta you are okay with two black people being in a room together talking unsupervised, but the creators/writers are not.

    I would rather Caroline be there because then her stuff wouldn’t crowd into Bonnie’s story. And Caroline would want to be more focused on Bonnie than bring up her own drama. Caroline is all about avoidance and forgetting her problems.

    “OMG I just gave birth to the doppelganger!” lol

    WTF IS THIS BLACK PERSON DOING I A FLASH BACK! That’s all I can here.

    So about Abby staying away maybe there were some conflicts between her and Bonnie’s dad. Maybe there were ultimatums. Maybe Abby wanted to see Bonnie, but outside of MF. She could have asked her husband to bring their daughter and he refused. *shrugged* So much we could know about …

    Maybe Abby felt guilty for leaving Bonnie and is subconsciously cutting herself off from her magical abilities.

    The moment Abby becomes unblocked on this show she will be dead … They can not have a woman of color be shown to be powerful unless she is under the thumb of some sort of vampire agenda. She has to be useful to a vampire for her to continue on.

    I wish she could have talked to Caroline … I figured you would be happy as soon as I saw Elena in the basement with Bonnie in front of the coffins. I thought of you. Why not let Elena know. Let Elena know so she can arugue about it with the Salvatore’s and then Bonnie and Caroline can go see about Bonnie’s mom. Caroline needs a break anyway.

    Klaus would threaten one of the Salvatore’s.

    “Stefan is so Stank in this episode” LOL

    You know that if Bonnie did that she would be labeled “Uppity” And I side eye when white people call black people “Uppity” Cause I know there’s a second part to that. Uppity N—.

    See if Elena had been left behind … she could have dealt with Stefan and Bonnie wouldn’t have had all of these interruptions when she’s meeting her mother.

    Stefan is way more dangerous than Damon.

    “Too old.” I thought the same thing. Maybe Bonnie meant (irrational rationalization coming …) she’s too old to be her daughter or maybe that was an old ass picture and Bonnie read the date. You know Elena was asking if every black woman in that pile was her mother tho. cause we all look alike. *snap*

    NOPE Elena doesn’t say think you to Bonnie … Elena is barely holding on to this friendship.

    I feel like Elena only said it’s not Bonnie’s problem because it doesn’t really affect Elena in a way where she needs Bonnie’s powers immediately. “Oh Bonnie it’s a slow moment now you can take a break, we don’t really need you so you don’t have to do this (for me! I release you).” OR it could be a guilt tactic. because Elena waited till they were elbow deep in the search before she said this. Maybe Elena thought Bonnie was doing this all for her “Because that’s how Bonnie is!”

    Wilson is Bonnie’s Dad’s last name. Ha do you think that he ever tried to change the name back after Abby left him and Sheila was over there almost everyday calling Bonnie a Bennett just so the name would stick.Or maybe she made him some kind of accommodations tea so that he would leave Bonnie’s name alone. lol

    Damon wants to go so he can be with Elena during and he’s used to being on the trips.

    The scene with the car. You didn’t think they were going to get one. 😉 they did end up talking about “Delena” but really it was more about Elena’s experience with it. That’s rare for Elena to have that kind of option to look in on it in a way where she’s not talking to the people who are directly involved. Bonnie can talk about something as mundane as “was it good” and not pass judgement. Elena should miss that. She really should.

    I liked the scene. I like that Bonnie didn’t make a huge deal about it because really this trip was supposed to be about her and so she could be able to control the tone of the conversation and really it should be about her (Bonnie) feelings.

    I just wanted to know why Elena didn’t tell Bonnie she kissed Damon. It just makes it sound like he attacked her again … she could have taken responsibility for the kiss when she told Bonnie. That’s all. I don’t care if she runs up and down the street screaming she kissed Damon. It would be refreshing actually.

    When Stefan calls, I don’t know how Elena can talk kindly to Stefan after what happened last episode. NOPE!

    If they were looking for Abby over at Bonnie’s the worst thing that could have happened was her dad would see that she was looking for her mother, because Bonnie is not inviting vampires into her house.

    Stefan Stalker loves Elena … so that’s the reason.

    This is why Caroline should have gone instead of Elena … O_O this!

    they’re on speaking terms … she talked to him on the phone. She was nice to him even.

    I’m thinking there’s nothing the Salvatore’s can do to make Elena hate them. nothing

    So this is the difference between Caroline and Elena. Things happen to both these female characters, but somehow it’s worse when it happens to Caroline because she’s not on the same level as Elena. Even though Caroline is typically a monster she’s still not as dark as Elena is. Gosh is this the effect of JP’s writing. I have a feeling she’s not doing this on purpose the way it’s being communicated. She wants it to look like Elena is getting tougher but really she just takes a lot of shit. It’s like she owns these tigers and sometimes she gets scratched or bit by them but she still keeps them around like a crazy person because they protect her from other dangerous animals. She’s a crazy monster hoarder.

    We need some episodes where there is no Elena. We need to miss her. she needs a break. she needs to go and come back and not take this shit anymore.

    Elena with Matt, tolerable, enjoyable. Elena with Caroline and Bonnie and Jeremy and Jenna … when she is with the people she has know before the Salvatore’s I find that I don’t actively dislike her. It’s only the times when she regresses back to them. if she brings them up or talks about them or gets involved in their business and I can’t stand her.

    Elena hasn’t changed …

    Dude .. don’t even get me stared. It’s because Bonnie is supposed to do those things that Caroline and Elena get credit for. like you said. It’s Bonnie’s duty, but If Elena takes in a breath of fresh air it’s a freaking miracle. This guy told me this story about how he was in a beat-boxing competition with a white guy who did nothing and when the black guy went up there they basically told him “well that’s what you’re big lips are for”. smh

    Alta … this is making me Bitter. Bonnie is TM Strong Black Woman …

    Elijah took the huge stake out? I thought Damon staked him and then took it out. Apparently the stake subdues them … then shouldn’t you be able to cut off the head or take the damn ring off? Don’t they dip the dagger into the vile of ash? I guess John gave the vile to someone …

    I kinda want Jamie to be a werewolf, just cause I want on back in the narrative. And shouldn’t he know better than inviting just anybody into the house …?

    Bonnie has done a crap load of things for people who aren’t her family but maybe that’s because her own family left her (i.e. her mother).

    Abby reads Bonnie’s Diary. 😡

    lol Elena was so awkward in that scene … omg Elena did the thing “He’s cute for a black guy yeah!”

    “If Jamie wanted to flirt with you would you even know what to do?” WHAAAAAAAAAT! *snapped* Well there was that one time when she kinda shipped Ben/Bonnie, but look how that turned out :-\

    Jamie’s dad was a deadbeat Bonnie should have said “Oh really so was my mom.” Tension

    I wonder when Abby met Jamie’s dad and how hold was Jamie at the time. How old is he now?

    The differences are Black and White.

    You know that was a reference to Bill torturing Caroline

    LOL Bill is a torturer. that’s all he does. He came back to take Tyler’s side against Caroline. Bang up job dad.

    He’s a white man Alta. He knows his shit …

    Should have put him with Bonnie … *Kanye Shrugs*

    They put the threat of Bill to Tyler and are mostly relying on past character that the actor has played. the only reason this man can threaten a hybrid and kinda stand on a leg is because he was HRG in Heroes and he was BAD ASS on that show …. and that’s it.

    Who is Tyler? how does he feel more of himself when all he’s been is the result of abuse.

    snort* Damon faints at the sight of needles.

    Alaric and Jenna used to talk about drinking 😥

    “She said Jenna’s died, like Jenna died of natural causes.” LOL That’s natural for MF

    Tyler Mason and his dad … *shrug*
    LMAO Alta said Twat! lol

    ALTA ARE YOU FUCKING PLAYING MUSIC TO THIS!? I CAN’T! LMAO! I’M DYING! STOP I CAN’T BREATHE!

    Alta! sound effects! l’m dying! I can’t breathe!

    What if Klaus makes Elijah stupid

    I feel like forwood was worst.

    • We know who’s in the 4th coffin. didn’t they say we didn’t know who was in the coffin or something?

      Yeah, they said we didn’t know who or what was in it. Maybe JM was trolling. The interviewer went absolutely nowhere with it.

      too bad it’s not a ploy for Klaus to get everyone away from Bonnie so he can kidnap her since she is the most powerful.

      A distraction? That’s smarts Klaus doesn’t have anymore. I remember the distraction he made in 2.18 to get Bonnie and Elena alone.

      I would rather Caroline be there because then her stuff wouldn’t crowd into Bonnie’s story. And Caroline would want to be more focused on Bonnie than bring up her own drama. Caroline is all about avoidance and forgetting her problems.

      Word. There’s no way they wouldn’t given Caroline a moment if she was there. That’s not their priority when it comes to that friendship. They don’t feel this need to remind us of who is the lead.

      Maybe Abby felt guilty for leaving Bonnie and is subconsciously cutting herself off from her magical abilities.

      That’s what I think. That and I think she also feels guilty for abandoning her heritage.

      See if Elena had been left behind … she could have dealt with Stefan and Bonnie wouldn’t have had all of these interruptions when she’s meeting her mother.

      Lol. True. It’s not like Stefan provided any help to the witches while he was there.

      You know Elena was asking if every black woman in that pile was her mother tho.

      Well she had too. They were all named Abby Bennett. But you reminded me of something. Why was she asking Bonnie if those women were her mother? They had a picture. How much did they think Abby changed?

      Wilson is Bonnie’s Dad’s last name. Ha do you think that he ever tried to change the name back after Abby left him and Sheila was over there almost everyday calling Bonnie a Bennett just so the name would stick.Or maybe she made him some kind of accommodations tea so that he would leave Bonnie’s name alone. lol

      Lol. I hope he never tried to change it. I hope no matter his resentment he never became disrespectful towards Bonnie’s heritage.

      When Stefan calls, I don’t know how Elena can talk kindly to Stefan after what happened last episode. NOPE!

      Smh.

      Stefan Stalker loves Elena … so that’s the reason.

      Mags said his behavior in this episode was akin to an abusive/controlling boyfriend, and I agree. She pointed out how when he kicked that chair, Elena jumped.

      It’s like she owns these tigers and sometimes she gets scratched or bit by them but she still keeps them around like a crazy person because they protect her from other dangerous animals.

      I like this analogy. I meant to bring up Caroline. I remember earlier this season when her father was torturing her I said I didn’t feel bad because I knew the producers were just trying to manipulate my emotions. I wanted to say that the way Caroline gets screwed over and the way Elena does come off different, and there’s a higher chance I’ll stop paying attention to Elena being hurt before I do Caroline. There’s something more sinister in Elena’s case.

      This guy told me this story about how he was in a beat-boxing competition with a white guy who did nothing and when the black guy went up there they basically told him “well that’s what you’re big lips are for”. smh

      Wtf?

      I kinda want Jamie to be a werewolf, just cause I want on back in the narrative. And shouldn’t he know better than inviting just anybody into the house …?

      Wait, how could Stefan go into the barn? Isn’t that still private property?

      Jamie’s dad was a deadbeat Bonnie should have said “Oh really so was my mom.” Tension

      LOL!

      He’s a white man Alta. He knows his shit …

      Should have put him with Bonnie … *Kanye Shrugs*

      Ugh. It’s the witches who need to prove how they know stuff.

      Lol.

      snort* Damon faints at the sight of needles.

      Lmao.

      I remembered that while I was talking. I remembered how Janine, Jennifer, and I were exasperated because all Jenna and Ric talked about was drinking.

      “She said Jenna’s died, like Jenna died of natural causes.” LOL That’s natural for MF

      Lmao! True.

      ALTA ARE YOU FUCKING PLAYING MUSIC TO THIS!? I CAN’T! LMAO! I’M DYING! STOP I CAN’T BREATHE!

      Alta! sound effects! l’m dying! I can’t breathe!

      😉

      Noooooo!!!!! That’s a worst case scenario! Please don’t make me wish Elijah had stayed staked, show. I was already saying there was no point to bringing him back. And then he came back and I wondered what I was talking about. Don’t make me regret it!

      • Mags said his behavior in this episode was akin to an abusive/controlling boyfriend, and I agree. She pointed out how when he kicked that chair, Elena jumped.

        I think I jumped when he kicked the chair.

        Wait, how could Stefan go into the barn? Isn’t that still private property?

        I can only guess it’s not what they call home, but that gets blown out of the water because it’s not like the Lockwood’s were living in that cave …

  4. First off Hi lol been awhile

    I have to agree with you, if you noticed I barely post on the forum unless you post there, it is slightly depressing and there is a lot of negativity. There was an article were Nina mentioned the ”main players” being at the ball than all of a sudden it became ”oh my goodness even Nina doesnt see Bonnie as a main player” erm lol it is not that deep

    For Elena going with Bonnie, I actually get why Bonnie wanted Elena there and most likely wanted a form of support, but saying that another main reason Elena had to go was so that there could a Elena/Stefan scene thrown in there. When Stefan went there he went to probably check what Bonnie found out from Abby about the coffin but did we get a Bonnie/Abby/Stefan scene? exactly nope we got an Elena/Stefan scene so he can finally find out about the kiss and walk away dramatically lol

    Also lol about Elena, I watched that yt vid you were talking about and that was how she was acting, which is odd considering Jeremy just left most probably a few days ago and dont think Bonnie is over him yet so what was that about? lol

    Was also confused about Jamie speech when he was compelled considering Stefan said he was compelled I dont think it was needed to be said again lol

    Also have to agree about Stefan we all know if it was Damon even talking to Bonnie that way she would have set him on fire or something. Have we even gotten Bonnie’s thoughts about Stefan and the whole switch/ripper situation?

    lol have to agree about Klaus dude was just chilling at home with his hybrids and Stefan comes there to threaten him, I think he is obseseed with Klaus now, every ep it seems like he has to go see and talk to him and klaus hasnt done that much lately except building a house lol

    Has anyone ever thanked Bonnie? The only person I can think of is Stefan in season1 and early season2,

    Caroline love her but thought the forwood sl was underwhelming.

    Alaric/Meredith boring, why is Alaric telling her everything? where does he know her from? I just kept wanting him to shut up by nxt ep she will pobably know every single detail and I feel like it was just a way for her to be a part of the gang quickly.

    • NIKKIIIIII!!!!! *Waves vigorously*

      Yeah, I saw that. The Nina quote is annoying just on the principle of the thing, but it’s not reason to go writing ten posts about it. I don’t even go there after a new (Bonnie) episode because I know chances are good people will focus on the bad more than the good. And it’s just draining.

      Absolutely, Stefan went so there could be a Delena scene. It’s weird because he came down on Elena when it was Bonnie who said she’d call him if she found anything. But eh, we were probably spared another scene of Bonnie being submissive to Stefan.

      exactly nope we got an Elena/Stefan scene so he can finally find out about the kiss and walk away dramatically lol

      Walk away dramatically….to go stand by the car. I laughed when my friend pointed that out to me.

      It’s odd how little importance Elena seems to give Bonnie’s heartbreak over Jeremy. I guess she really took Bonnie saying she (Elena) can’t be mad at Jeremy to heart *____*. In episode 11 she was saying she knew Bonnie/Jeremy have unfinished business, yet here she is trying to push her on some guy. And by her words, Jeremy was spiraling in part because of Bonnie breaking up with him so….what is her thought process here? Smh.

      Nope. There hasn’t been a peep from Bonnie about Stefan being a Ripper. She did speak to him like she clearly thought him stealing the coffins was stupid but then Stefan rudely went, “You’re a witch; you’ll figure something else.” And she said nothing. Ugh!

      Maybe if Klaus was being evol Stefan would have been focused on him instead of Elena and Bonnie. Lol. As it is he needed to channel that aggression elsewhere.

      Damon’s thanked her, and Jeremy thanked her after she brought him back to life. Considering everything Bonnie has done, it’s funny that I can remember every instance where someone has thanked her. But you know who’s never thanked Bonnie? Elena. Not after she kept her human, not after she saved her brother’s life…never.

      If I had my way, Meredith would be using Alaric. He is so eager to spill everything, yet he couldn’t tell Jenna after dating her for months. I guess this is him “learning from his mistake?” Please.

  5. I agree with your sum up of the episode. On rewatch I fast-forwarded to the Bonnie/Abby scenes. I liked some of the Stefan/Elena scenes on the first watch, but now they don´t do anything for me.
    I saw the link to the original post on vd-net and read it, but thanks for linking us to another discussion about it (I love the things you and the other posters pointed out), because I also saw the comments and thought the same (and I saw the discussion about it in the Bonnie thread on vd-net – some of the posts are nightmarish, good to know somebody called these posters out)
    I think I saw the discussion you mentioned on tumblr about her dresses (didn´t like her 50ths dance outfit, liked or loved all the other ones) and I see many post like you also mentioned from Bonnie fans. I know it´s frustrating to be a Bonnie fan/stan many times, but we mustn´t forget the development we saw over the three seasons. I think the show made many mistakes with Bonnie in regards to screen time or missed sls (also with the other characters, but I care about her the most) but with the scenes we got I can understand her development from the girl in the pilot to the woman and witch we saw last episode. Of course I would have loved to see her grace my screen more often, but that´s the failure of the writers.

    I agree, it´s always relevant especially with them changing the time where the Salvatores come from.
    I loved that scene in season one (that´s when she lights the candles, right?), missed something like that during season 2 especially in the final with the whole GWTW screening.

    JoMo: Thanks for the interview … he doesn´t make sense with his comment about that Stefan/Klaus past and the writers don´t telling him. Now I want to see how it would have played out if he knew it. But in the end we didn´t get anything out of it anyway, because he compelled him in the end.
    It doesn´t work for me too. These century old vampires are so pathetic … did they even left the house to get to know somebody until the 21th century?
    I think he knows because they already opened it … I think it will be opened this week. Yep that interviewer must have been not very spoiler-obsessed. I would have asked. Lol.

    SPOILERS:
    – Ep 14: Matt´s is from Rebekah, she wants to make it up for the Homecoming- fiasco. I don´t think Katherine will come back in the next episodes and I don´t want her back anyway.
    – I thought Damon was the only one she could trust … at least that was something JP said. Maybe she has to decide which Original brother she can trust – there will probably be four of them at the ball.
    – I think it´s Rebekah, because somebody on set said Katherine won´t be in ep 15 … and that´s when Elena sees Damon with somebody in bed. It looks like sleeping with Damon is Rebekahs one (?) approach to take revenge on Elena. She is 1000 years and that´s the only way she can think of? I´m underwhelmed. And I really hate that we now get to see Damon and Rebekah after I hoped that they would do something between Rebekah and Stefan. It looks like Stefan will be bonded to Elena the whole series.
    – Bonnie not there: I love Cana´s idea. But you´re right he isn´t that smart anymore.
    – Ep 15: If they really opened the coffin in ep 13, why is Klaus so happy and eager to throw a ball and if the ritual has something to do with Abby and Bonnie opening the coffin (or doing something wrong) why would they wait another ep to appease the spirits?
    – Either what´s in the coffin, doesn´t help the gang (perhaps is dangerous for them) or they tricked Klaus again, opened the coffin, whatever is in it comes out and agrees to help them, they seal the coffin again (after putting stones or whatever in it) and give it back to Klaus. He will be so happy, that he throws a party the week after that.
    – Elena´s plan is probably good this time.
    – I´m also excited about that part … but worried too, probably mainly because of Kats tweet. Which I think is in regards to this ep. I speculated with someone in the ff-Spoilers thread on the Kat board and I think Persia White tweeted (http://twitter.com/#!/RealPersiaWhite/status/151181868711153664) something about a twists coming (ep 15 script)- yeh there are always twist but with Joseph interview about Abby being in danger because of working against him (his threats again) he would go against them … and perhaps turn Abby for the shock effect into a vampire? She would lose her powers for real this time if the writers still remember the canon they established. He does something “very evil” in this episode said one of the producers. But it could also be like in episode 17 when Bonnie channeled the power of the witches that she would feel pain – perhaps the spirits of nature want to punish them and she cries.
    – Jamie: I think the actor only speculates … and I agree with you especially with the final part of the season approaching, I didn´t see any chemistry, but I need more scenes for it to judge and that simply wasn´t the focus of the episode it was Abby/Bonnie

    EPISODE

    Didn´t even thought about Caroline and her sl … because she wasn´t mentioned in the synopsis and the “also stars”. I was surprised to see her and I agree with you she was a prob … and with her walking into her house I was sadly reminded that we didn´t see anything like that for Bonnie in all three seasons, but Caroline got it two episodes in a row.

    Bonnie/Abby

    – Loved the whole dream sequence with the gravestones the lightning and the atmosphere, all the shots of Bonnie face we got. Stunning
    – Agree with you about the whole Abby leaving situation, but I really want to know more about it and I really hope they explore this
    – Abby was the best friend of Miranda, Bonnie is the best friend of Elena, were Grams and Grandma Gilbert (btw where are all the grandparents in this town, besides Grams and Tiki Grandpa we didn´t see anybody) also best friends?
    – Hated Elena´s being involved into that sl and the retcon
    – And I really hate that Abby almost lost all her powers because she entombed Mikael and Katherine simply walking into that tomb and putting the chains away and he is awake. That´s not fair.
    – Love that scene you described … that would probably make me cry too
    – Stefan/Bonnie: I can´t with it, it bothered me in ep 10 and it bothered me this episode even more. We didn´t get to see Stefan interact with Caroline (I thought I read a spoiler he would wish her a happy birthday) until now … so I don´t know how she would react to it, but we only saw Elena giving him contra … perhaps she (out of the girls) is the only one who is supposed to – simply to show us how much she is grown and how strong she is that is why Bonnie can´t react the same way (especially not if she is in the same scene with Elena), Elena has to stand out.
    – I really didn´t see that scene that way, I was happy because she said that this goes beyond them, but that interpretation is valid if you look at the Stefan/Bonnie interactions
    – I couldn´t understand what she said to Elena when she showed her the picture – thanks for clearing this up, Damon and Jeremy are the only ones thanking her that´s not a good
    – Perhaps Damon liked Abby´s picture and wanted to see her in real life … or he likes to drive around with a hybrid
    – My favourite scene between them was when the spoke about Grams, Persia and Kat did an awesome job

    Stefan/Elena/Damon

    – I don´t have any friends who watch that show or who look realistically at the triangle. My feelings in regards to the triangle are most of the time non-existent since season one. They are just there for me. So I really don´t have an opinion in that matter.
    – Some fans are going to hate Elena Kevin … that´s inevitable, the rapid shippers will rage if she choose not their favored brother

    Elena:

    – Loved that smart move against Jamie … but with you mentioning about the compulsion, I didn´t even recognized that. That´s dumb on the writers part.
    – I agree with what you said about that badass moments and the treating in regards to Caroline/Elena vs. Bonnie, right the audience follows the leader fangirl JP

    Daggers:

    – Uncle John had the ash brought with him … perhaps Isobel found it?
    – Klaus must have a lot of this ash with him constantly stabbing his siblings
    – But wouldn´t some of the ash stay in the body/heart even with taking out the dagger? So they couldn´t awake until the wound is washed out.
    – Why had nobody the idea (if there is so much ash from that tree anyways) to put all the ash into a baking dish or something like that, throw wood glue in it, let it dry or put it in the oven … and then carve a stake out of the result of this cooking experiment – *tada* you have a weapon to kill Klaus like Mikael had

    I thought so too, when I saw Jamie coming in and wiping his hands.
    I don´t know that video, will look it up. But I saw Elena´s reaction too … that was strange. I don´t think I ever saw the whole ep with the carnival that is why I don´t remember her reactions to him.
    I´m with you on the Jamie part, that wasn´t a good introduction for a character who possible is returning and will be a possible love interest.

    Tyler/Caroline/Bill:

    – Caroline looked off for me too perhaps aftermath of the hybrid bite … or Klaus blood was stained
    – Don´t feel anything from Caroline in regards to Tyler, last ep with his whole speech, this ep the same
    – Bill has a master in “Siring and Compulsion”
    – Poor Tyler, he will probably be back in five episodes and we will get the first Tyler/Bonnie scenes ever because now he wants to kill Klaus – probably also because of Caroline
    – I literally laughed out loud when Tyler ran to attack Bill, the last shot of Bill … I don´t know why but it looked so funny, like he didn´t even run for his life only jogging, of course he doesn´t die … that happens this week

    Meredith/Dalaric:

    – Not interested in the character at all but she will get more screen time than Abby
    – Alaric should just go with Damon
    – Why did he tell her everything after he met her for a hot minute?
    – Elena probably wants him for herself
    – Grams/Bonnie and Matt/Vicki were probably handled the best

    Klaus:

    – I think next season he will be part of the group, if he survives
    – Loved the witches for giving him aneurysms he deserved it. Wonderful
    – rolling on the floor with poetic!Klaus at first I thought something was wrong in my head because I heard the music lmao you should do this more often
    – Elijahs return *standing ovations* could help Klaus I agree

    Least Favourite character: that Hybrid Klaus sent to Abby (I didn´t realize until now that he is the guy about who you spoke in one of your podcast)
    Favourite scene: dream sequence because of the beautiful shots and Abby/Bonnie speaking about Grams
    Storyline that wasn´t needed: Probably Tyler/Bill/Caroline
    I cheered not for Stefan but for me because I wanted to slap Damon for that ugly shower scene last episode.

    • and I saw the discussion about it in the Bonnie thread on vd-net – some of the posts are nightmarish, good to know somebody called these posters out

      It was giving me heartburn.

      Yeah that’s the thing: I sometimes get the impression that some Bonnie fans just aren’t willing to look at the stuff we do get for Bonnie.

      Yeah, it’s the scene where she lit the candles.

      These century old vampires are so pathetic … did they even left the house to get to know somebody until the 21th century?
      I think he knows because they already opened it … I think it will be opened this week.

      Lol! For real!

      I think you’re right. I rewatched the trailer and the coffin is open behind Bonnie. The only thing I’m not getting is, if the coffin is opened this Thursday, then 1)why are Abby and Bonnie missing in episode 14 and 2)why is everyone literally having a ball?

      And I really hate that we now get to see Damon and Rebekah after I hoped that they would do something between Rebekah and Stefan.

      I hate it because Rebekah already told his butt no.

      or they tricked Klaus again, opened the coffin, whatever is in it comes out and agrees to help them, they seal the coffin again (after putting stones or whatever in it) and give it back to Klaus. He will be so happy, that he throws a party the week after that.

      Lol! He would do something like that.

      Thanks for the tweet! The twist Persia is talking about could have nothing to do with Abby. You know how the actors love to talk up the whole show. Robert Ri’chard was talking in that interview like he was a series regular and the writers were giving him great stuff.

      Abby was the best friend of Miranda, Bonnie is the best friend of Elena, were Grams and Grandma Gilbert (btw where are all the grandparents in this town, besides Grams and Tiki Grandpa we didn´t see anybody) also best friends?

      It’s too much. Don’t forget that Katherine and Emily were….not friends…but Emily did things for Katherine. Ugh.

      And I really hate that Abby almost lost all her powers because she entombed Mikael and Katherine simply walking into that tomb and putting the chains away and he is awake. That´s not fair.

      For real! Where exactly was the magic?! There wasn’t even any traps set so any vampire or human could have gotten him out.

      (I thought I read a spoiler he would wish her a happy birthday)

      I think that was just the spoiler person wishing.

      Lol @ Damon wanting to meet Abby. The one thing I couldn’t hear in that scene and still can’t is what Elena says to Bonnie when she shows her the two head shots. What the heck does she say? Nina swallows the words so much. I think she says something about Honolulu?

      Bill has a master in “Siring and Compulsion”

      Lmao.

      I literally laughed out loud when Tyler ran to attack Bill, the last shot of Bill … I don´t know why but it looked so funny, like he didn´t even run for his life only jogging, of course he doesn´t die

      He got to the door and didn’t even open it. He just stood there and watched Tyler come at him.

      rolling on the floor with poetic!Klaus at first I thought something was wrong in my head because I heard the music lmao you should do this more often

      Lmao. I had a feeling that some people might think a tab opened in their browser or something. Yeah, I’m definitely going to see if I can incorporate more sound effects into the podcasts. Hopefully the show gives me things to work with.

      I thought about mentioning Paul Newman’s grandson but he was so inconsequential that I didn’t. I probably would have mentioned him had Abby killed his character and not Elijah.

      I cheered not for Stefan but for me because I wanted to slap Damon for that ugly shower scene last episode.

      LOL!!!!!

  6. I can understand that JM wants his character to stick around but Klaus needs to die. And I’m very afraid that JP/the writers may fall in love with his character, just like she/they fell in love with Elijah in S3, and keep him alive.

    Yeah, I read a lot of JM interviews in which he said that he was pushing for a love interest. I don’t really get why he wants to have one either. Other than that he may think that it might keep him on the show – similar to how Daniel Gillies is pushing for Elejah. (And now that I think of Elejah, that’s another one of those ‘vampire is impressed with very special girl’ stories.)

    Spoilers

    If Rebekah is Matt’s secret admirer it will be because he was her date for the Homecoming dance and since she couldn’t go to that dance, she decides the she now wants to go with Matt to the ball.

    I think Damon will sleep with Rebekah. Not because Rebekah/Damon makes any sense but because, like you said, Damon sleeping with Katherine would be very messed up, considering he is in love with her look-alike. The writers wouldn’t want to taint the impending Delena that way, I think. – If it is Rebekah, I think it will play out like this: They will have Damon and Rebekah in a similar emotional state in 3×14. Damon will be upset over Stelena and Rebekah will be upset over who knows what. Maybe Klaus/Caroline, maybe Matt upsetting her (and indicating he’s still into Caroline?) or maybe even Stelena as well. Then Damon and Rebekah will have a moment of connecting with each other, since they’ve similar issues in that ep, and this will lead them to having sex.

    Episode

    W/r/t the inclusion of Elena in Bonnie’s story:
    1. Yes, she was not needed. When she said “You knew my mom?”, I got so scared that the focus would shift to her.
    2. Such an unnecessary retcon. Things like that show how little the writers care about telling a coherent story. I wonder what it will be like to rewatch the series once S3 is over. Especially S2 (after the introduction of Elijah) and S3.

    Was Klaus chilling at home? I thought he was at the Salvatore boardinghouse waiting for Stefan.

    Stefan/Bonnie is grating. I can’t deal with it either. It is beyond awful. I don’t understand the Bonnie/Stefan fans who are OK with that. As a former Stefan/Bonnie shipper, these scenes give me rage blackouts. Anyway, I suspect the reason the writer had Bonnie react in this way was to prop Elena as tough and provide an excuse for a Stelena phone scene with Elena sassing Stefan. This show and its priorities.

    I really like your thoughts on Elena becoming darker and the triangle being dysfunctional only because of Damon and Stefan. I totally agree. This thing about “Elena considers herself as part of the monsters” doesn’t work for me because it is too convenient. And like you said, it’s simply not canon. It’s only canon that Elena keeps being involved with the Salvatores because she “isn’t one to check out”, something which, too, is way too convenient for my taste. (On a similar note I saw some fan speculation about a possible rekindling of Matt/Elena. Some triangle shippers said that they were interested in seeing that and see that relationship crash and burn because Elena is ‘ruined for normal guys’. This made me think how I just don’t see Elena as being ruined for a normal relationship or a normal life in general. Like you said, keep her away from the Salvatores (and basically any vampire that isn’t Caroline, since there was also the Rose incident) and she is functional.)

    I don’t have any Stelena/Delena fandom friends I could ask but from reading this one Delena meta you linked I got the impression that they deal with the awful stuff Damon has put her through by arguing that it’s still on her mind and she hasn’t truly forgiven him and never will. Which is not what I see is happening on the show, I’m sorry to say. As for Stelena … I actually haven’t read a meta about Stelena that looks at them realistically. If anybody happens to have a link to one, I’d be very interested in reading it.

    When it comes to Elena and the writers, I can say that I had an eye-opening moment recently. JP was answering fan questions on twitter and some fans asked her if she shipped Delena or Stelena (rme, this fandom). And, of course, she answered that she is Team Salvatore and wants both brothers to be happy. Of course, how else could it be. Then a fan asked her something along the lines of “And what about Elena? I want her to be happy too” (kudos to this fan!). To which JP replied something like “Elena is only 18 years old, she doesn’t know what she wants.” Maybe I’m reading too much into this and maybe I’m too cynical but I found it very telling that she didn’t reply with a simple “Of course, I want Elena to be happy too.” This doesn’t seem to be one of her priorities. Plus, this part about Elena not knowing what she wants also sounds very convenient to me, since it allows the writers to twist and bend her as they please. And also, “Elena doesn’t know what she wants” sounds to me like it is just all about her part in the triangle.

    I have a hard time buying into the idea that Elena is changed and darker now. That is because for me the darkest thing she has ever done was to stab herself in order to trick Elijah. And that was in S2, not in S3.

    When Stefan told Elena that she ‘couldn’t be doing things like this by herself’, I immediately thought of this one episode review by JP – the one about the episode in which Elena decides to hunt down a werewolf pack during a full moon. Remember how JP said that ‘of course this would go badly since Damon wasn’t there’? This feels like the same thing. The writers once again tell us that Elena can’t do anything without a Salvatore by her side. Because it isn’t ~safe without them. I hate this so much. What are these writers thinking?

    Like somebody (songspin?) has pointed out, this is the third time now that we got torture rehab sessions. What is up with that? What is going on in the writers’ room? Why are the writers so fascinated by that stuff?

    At least all that bone breaking is now taking place off-screen. I’m sorry to say it but I’m glad that Tyler isn’t in the next 5 eps.

    Alaric/Meredith/Damon was a snoozefest. That’s all I can say about that SL.

    I hope Elijah is smart again. I really hope so.

    • I can understand that JM wants his character to stick around but Klaus needs to die.

      His character hinders the storylines the show can do because they aren’t willing to explore him to his fullest. So Klaus needs to die.

      If Rebekah is Matt’s secret admirer it will be because he was her date for the Homecoming dance and since she couldn’t go to that dance, she decides the she now wants to go with Matt to the ball.

      Yeah, I’m sure it’ll be revealed that she’s always wanted to go to a ball with a guy much younger than her *____*.

      Rebekah is supposed to be super pissed, so I hope she ends up killing Damon for being stupid enough to sleep with someone he knows wants their blood. I know I’ll be disappointed on that front.

      I wonder what it will be like to rewatch the series once S3 is over. Especially S2 (after the introduction of Elijah) and S3.

      Yeah, I keep thinking of watching season 2 for a third time, and maybe even rewatching the first half of this season, or going all the way back to season 1, but the writers’ priorities are such a mess that they change every half a season, and I can’t deal with the fact that I’m supposed to think it all matches up and it was all planned as much as possible. I get drained just thinking about it. I can rewatch season 3 over the summer.

      Was Klaus chilling at home? I thought he was at the Salvatore boardinghouse waiting for Stefan.

      Wait what? No that can’t have been the Salvatore house….the doorway doesn’t lead straight to the living room like that. Right? Great, now I’m unsure.

      Anyway, I suspect the reason the writer had Bonnie react in this way was to prop Elena as tough and provide an excuse for a Stelena phone scene with Elena sassing Stefan. This show and its priorities.

      Ugh. If Elena is involved, there can only be one. That seems to be the show’s thinking.

      This made me think how I just don’t see Elena as being ruined for a normal relationship or a normal life in general

      Yeah, this goes back to what I was ranting about when Jeremy was compelled a second time. Elena and the show seems to view it as Elena’s stuck and she has no choice and she has to put up with this because such is her tragic life. Thing is, Elena’s not a witch. She’s not defeating any monsters. Heck Abby was defeating monsters and the show made it so not even she was stuck. Elena’s life is tragic and dramatic, but it’s not fated to be that way. I honestly think if the Salvatores dropped dead next episode she would go on to live better than she has the past 2 seasons and a half.

      And, of course, she answered that she is Team Salvatore and wants both brothers to be happy.

      Oh my God, JP. Wrong freaking answer. *Sigh.* This is the Girl Power person KG was talking about? I completely agree with your impression. “She doesn’t know what she wants” is super dismissive when Elena is supposed to be the heroine of the show. Elena’s happiness, heck Elena as an individual, is an afterthought to her which is probably why we had to get to season 3 before we delved inside her head in any meaningful way. And now that a Salvatore is back to being in his right mind (Stefan), who knows what’s in store for Elena’s story.

      When Stefan told Elena that she ‘couldn’t be doing things like this by herself’, I immediately thought of this one episode review by JP – the one about the episode in which Elena decides to hunt down a werewolf pack during a full moon. Remember how JP said that ‘of course this would go badly since Damon wasn’t there’? This feels like the same thing.

      I remember that! And you’re right! And Elena’s idea to go talk to a pack of werewolves on a full moon was way more reckless than what happened in 3.12. I also think that’s something else: Elena isn’t allowed to be reckless. Not the way Damon is. To JP, Damon being reckless is apparently cute and just Damon being Damon. But Elena needs a Salvatore (and sometimes her friends backing the Salvatore) to keep her in check.

  7. Yes, some Bonnie fans just don’t see her and bothers me a lot. It seems like a lot of it has to will love interest stuff. Jeremy wasn’t good enough, and then she didn’t Klaus so she is the ugly duckling. I get being upset about stuff, but I feel like if Bonnie was Damon LI or Klaus’ they would all be okay with her only getting 2mins of screen and not having parents or a house. So yeah sometimes I read those comments about Bonnie from Bonnie fans and *rolls eyes*.

    It’s funny because at Eyecon JM was saying he would rather have Klaus die than have him hanging out at the Grille. JM your one stop away from it.

    I think they said Bonnie heavy which it was. I don’t know what people want there was never going to be a good enough reason she’s been gone for 15 yrs. If she wasn’t in the hospital or being held captive than it wasn’t going to good enough.
    Yeah I liked her reason for leaving because we’ve seen what witch craft does. The toll it takes on them.

    Stefan/Bonnie is the worse in 3×10 it bothered me and in this episode it bothered me. Stefan needs to watch his tone when he talks to Bonnie. Bonnie seems so apologetic for disappointing him for not doing what HE told her.

    I’m just so happy that it was said once on this show. Elena is better than BOTH Salvatore brothers I needed that. They need her she doesn’t need them. Julie is like the fandom they don’t see Elena she is Stefan’s true love and Damon’s humanity all they need to survive and be better. Elena what is a Elena? there’s a Stelena, there’s a Delena. After the crap that was S2 I feel like I’ve been seeing Elena again especially in 3×11 please don’t regress show.

    It bothers me that we are supposed to be okay with everything the Salvatores do to Elena. That we are supposed to want her to end up with one of them. There’s nothing that they could do that would have the fandom stop shipping her with they’re preferred brother.
    But Bonnie is the worst friend ever for lying about the device and they hate her because she is the worst friend ever to Elena. But these brothers could do anything to her and it’s okay they are still the best.

    I just don’t care about Bill Forbes and the Tyler situation. Why was Caroline in this episode? It’s okay for her to miss a episode it really is. I think Julie’s favoritism was showing again. I think she looks for ways to put Caroline in each episode.

    Alaric/Meredith/Damon don’t care I have really started hating Ric and I just want him to die if I’m being honest. Some of the main male cast needs to go starting with Klaus and Alaric.

    Klaus, the best thing about Klaus this season was your poem during the podcast with music awesome by the way. The witches torturing him was great too.

    Everything with Bonnie/Abby was great.

    • but I feel like if Bonnie was Damon LI or Klaus’ they would all be okay with her only getting 2mins of screen and not having parents or a house.

      Yep, I get the same exact feeling. A lot of the complaints stem from Bonnie’s love life and I just can’t relate to that because that’s symptomatic of bigger problems. And those problems are what I’d rather talk/complain about.

      It’s funny because at Eyecon JM was saying he would rather have Klaus die than have him hanging out at the Grille. JM your one stop away from it.

      Oh, I remember that! Lmao.

      Yeah, I agree. The episode was Bonnie-heavy and we haven’t had that in a long time. Not even in 2.18. Yeah, unless Abby was being captive or her never calling was tantamount to Bonnie’s safety, the reason was never going to be good enough.

      Bonnie seems so apologetic for disappointing him for not doing what HE told her.

      Exactly! And that drive me up the wall.

      But Bonnie is the worst friend ever for lying about the device and they hate her because she is the worst friend ever to Elena. But these brothers could do anything to her and it’s okay they are still the best.

      Yeah, that’s a double standard that doesn’t occur to me often. How the same people who hold Bonnie to such strict standards when it comes to being a good friend, will ship Delena (because I don’t know if there are Stelena fans who hate Bonnie).

      Why was Caroline in this episode? It’s okay for her to miss a episode it really is.

      For real.

      Thanks! Klaus needs to go. He is brining in way too many characters on the show.

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