Episode 27: Kill Or Be Killed

Episode 27

Stefan and Elena’s fake fight/break up is both boring and pointless. Stefan needs to get out with his “I’m the nice Salvatore,” crap. Mason officially becomes the bad guy (since Stefan now regards him as one); Caroline is unable to kick ass when it comes to Damon (aka when it counts), and Liz Forbes rocks the episode.

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16 thoughts on “Episode 27: Kill Or Be Killed

  1. Hello Alta. Yay! This is your first job! Awww yay! I’m a stalker. 😡

    Plot hole to make Katherine weak. Also how did Katherine get into the mansion after Elena became the owner?

    Kat Graham!

    I can’t watch the dude crack his head on the ground. It’s just horrible.
    “Lights out forever” lol so bad. “Person loses their life, curses yours forever” mmmm. Deep

    Also vampires aren’t supposed to be out in the day time.

    Lol oh crap Jeremy/Bonnie. They only talk to each other. Jeremy left the show to buff up.

    Elena is just trying to horde all the information. Tell’em, Alta!

    This fake fighting! Isn’t there another thing that could be on the screen.

    Caroline and Liz! I bet Caroline is upset that her own mother couldn’t protect her, when she spends most of her time protecting the town. And her mother knows about vampires but not the Salvatore’s. Caroline thinks Liz has failed as a mother. She feels neglected and she is rude, but come on mom.

    How did Katherine get in? Doesn’t Liz have to invite her in?

    Carol and her speeches. I so thought about the Black History Gala that not going to happen (because it bring everyone down).

    No one’s looking for Logan.

    Stefan and Mason. Smh Stefan is being a bully. He wanted to kill Damon when he killed Lexi. Stefan didn’t get an arc but the moonstone did. Yup, Stefan is just covering all his bases.

    “And Stefan … SHUT UP!” lol We are watching the show wrong. Jeremy didn’t get over it … it’s just that whenever he talks about it, the cameras aren’t there. Mason is too long in the tooth to fall for Damon and Stefan’s BS.

    “The pizza delivery vampire” lol
    Freak show at a wake – Can you not be in this club unless you or someone close to you dies?

    Damon is her friend … that came out of nowhere. He totally abuse Caroline.

    Elena’s not even listening to Caroline. Smh a “head case”
    I miss Bonnie!

    Elena and Stefan did lag it. Why are they fake fighting? Bonnie would have called Caroline out about Katherine … sigh.

    I hate that Damon coming up to Caroline like they are on some buddy -buddy level and asking her why she’s being a bitch to her mother “his friend”. please! At least character continuity.

    I’m noticing a lot of women apologizing for their behavior and hardly ever any men doing it. It’s not just the VD either.

    Jeremy was staring like a creeper. If anyone looked up and saw him that would have been hard to explain.

    Over reacting much, Tyler?

    That’s why I said Bonnie would have just called Caroline on it. Elena! Why are you acting this way? It’s not all about you! Caroline is in some kind of trouble and yet it’s all about you and how she’s treating you.

    What! Say it again!

    Stefan and Damon have a little choke fest and no one notices. Stefan marks Mason for dead and I don’t like it. How come no one heard the shots? Guns are loud. They probably want mason to run away from the party or whatever so that he doesn’t draw attention with his screaming. :[

    I thought Mason might die this episode. I was glad it didn’t end up that way.

    Jeremy … dull light bulb moment.

    I like that idea and then there would have been strife between Elena and Jeremy because Jeremy’s on the side of the werewolves (because they haven’t killed/kidnapped him unlike the vampires). And then hopefully Mason wouldn’t have died and them Bonnie could have more time with the werewolves and … sigh. I really wanted werewolf/witch against vampire. I really wanted that.

    Slave! Slave quarters. *snort*

    I love that Mason grabs her head. IDK it’s just so cute (even thought she looks like she‘s choking :X). it looked like Big brother Little sister.

    Go Liz! I wish Liz just killed them both. I really do.

    I think Carline looks worried because her mom is down there. She wasn’t expecting that.

    Elena … smh

    Caroline had punch bowl mouth. If I were Liz I think I would have peed my pants from the shock. Can we talk about how if Bonnie hadn’t made Caroline’s ring both Stefan and Damon would be dead. Bonnie working with this vampires is upsetting the balance and I wish they would show Bonnie reacting to that.

    My mom walked in right as they were feeding on the black cop and asked; “what is this Vampire Diaries?’ then she walked out because she was so disgusted.

    Is Elena snapping at Caroline or both or them?

    I think Caroline says you hate me because of the vampire thing. That’s what I choose to believe anyway.

    Smh. The dialogue. I do like what Liz says.

    I wonder if Caroline is still traumatized from Damon, because she is really futile in that seen. She just stands there like a wounded dove. :[

    I wish Caroline went ape-shit and turned into the hulk because of Damon putting his hands on her mom. This is unbelievable when ,like you said, moments before she was kicking Mason’s ass. :[

    Aww man! Bonnie’s in the gang. :[

    This scene! “THIS WHOLE SCENE CAN SHUT UP!” WORD! Bonnie fraught against Damon and she got turned into a trope the very next episode to make a ring so that these dudes could die in this episode.

    Where are the Elena fans, indeed.

    The girls are drunk.
    I thought she was dead too! And I thought can we take a breath before we activate Tyler’s cruse! She probably had a delayed reaction when she hit the floor.

    Liz is being forced to lie. I’m wondering why Liz doesn’t ask how Caroline became a vampire. She should be accusing Damon ever since she found out that they were vampires. I would love to hear her ask Damon “ … did you do it?” And have him finally come clean (to a degree) about victimizing Caroline. Have Liz’s anger affect this monster. Then I’ll believe the friendship.

    Where did Elena go? She ran after Caroline, but she must’ve sensed that Stefan wasn’t right behind her or she remembered that Caroline was betraying her and went back to Stefan …

    Elena doesn’t want to talk about it because it’s not directly about her. 😡

    FAKE FIGHT! MY GOODNESS!

    Elena is an awesome friend … I can’t.

    That Fake fight took up too much time.

    Elena put her “friend” through hell and she was angry because Caroline was lying and spying. Elena is a suck friend.

    “Why wouldn’t you think that Katherine threatened Caroline?” That’s my first thought when they find out that Caroline is under Katherine’s thumb she should have tried to communicate with Caroline to get her to confess so that she could be helped. Bonnie would have asked Caroline out right.

    Why does Elena have friends? It must be a doppelganger thing. Something about the spell makes Doppelgangers very appealing to the people around them.

    I would have loved for Caroline to be pissed off at Elena for knowing and not immediately helping her. I would love for Caroline to freak out that Elena made her suffer needlessly. She knew that Caroline was working for the woman who killed her and she said nothing and sent her back to Katherine like Caroline was a spy first and never someone Elena grew up with. That’s heartless. Jesus take the wheel!

    I wish Mason had rallied the troops against the vampires and told Carol that Liz went missing after she trapped the Salvatore brothers (who are also vampires) in a cellar on our land. It would have hit the fan then early in the season. 😉

    Gross to Damon’s eaves dropping.

    What the fuck! About Damon terrorizing Liz? Go home and remember your brother and what Damon did to him. REMEMBER ELENA! Bonnie should cast and memory spell on Elena! That would be wrong but Bonnie and Caroline should be at their breaking point.

    I would have gotten a bag from the basement. That’s just me. Elena is really good at stabbing herself, there is no hesitation. Maybe she thinks she can control it if she is the only one he gets blood from.

    I can’t wait till next episode when you unleash the dragon. 😡

    I gagged when they kissed and her blood was in her mouth. That is not cute.

    *gasp* Katherine … FLASHBACK!

    The end. *giggles*

    Didn’t Katherine have Klaus too? IDK Special Snow Flake Petrova.

    I like when Mason told Caroline he was going to tell her mother. :] and the little smile he gave.

    • Hi Cana. Lol.

      Katherine was able to get inside the Salvatore mansion because Elena died. But…I don’t know what happens when the person comes back to life. Apparently it doesn’t matter: they still lose ownership over the house?

      Jeremy left the show to buff up.

      Lol.

      Katherine probably pretended she was Elena and got in that way. Because when she showed up the first time, Caroline was sleeping. She probably acted like Elena came to pick Caroline up for school. Or something.

      Stefan didn’t get an arc but the moonstone did

      Word.

      Jeremy didn’t get over it … it’s just that whenever he talks about it, the cameras aren’t there.

      Oh my God!!! This will be my new saying when talking to people! “Nah, Bonnie talked about how she felt betrayed she felt when she found out the Martins were using her. She was hurt. The cameras just weren’t there to catch it.” Lmao.

      I would have loved werewolf/witch vs. vampires. I’ve been thinking about that a lot lately, and I wish it would have happened. Unfortunately since Tyler will be in a love thing with Caroline, he’ll probably become Damon’s buddy (since she’s part of the in group. She was even on a poster with the big three). *Sigh* There are so few aspects of this show I will actually be enjoying next season.

      Bonnie working with this vampires is upsetting the balance and I wish they would show Bonnie reacting to that.

      Yes! I wish Bonnie would talk about the negative things that happen because of her helping the vamps. Starting with the negative thing that happens to her body. For example, the witches got mad at her when she tried to use their powers and resources they gave her to help Damon. Because of this, they didn’t want to help her save Jeremy. I wish she’d talk about how always saying yes to these Salvatores isn’t always great for her.

      Lmao. Your mom knows what’s up.

      She snapped because they both said it, but the fact that she snapped after Caroline spoke and Caroline is the one who ended up putting her head down. Why didn’t they have Caroline be the first to suggest it so that Elena could end up snapping at Damon? It’s all about the choices the producers make. Or course Elena snapping at Damon probably would’ve been used as an opportunity to have Delena look at each other “meaningfully.”

      Caroline isn’t traumatized from Damon still. She pushed him and told him he sucks, remember?

      Why does Elena have friends? It must be a doppelganger thing. Something about the spell makes Doppelgangers very appealing to the people around them.

      Lmao. Mags calls it Doppelganger Pheromones.

      That would have been so great!!! But Mason was evol by this time. He didn’t curr what happened to Liz.

      Bonnie should cast and memory spell on Elena! That would be wrong but Bonnie and Caroline should be at their breaking point.

      Lmao.

      Katherine liked Klaus, but he wasn’t interested in anything more than killing her. Although…I feel like during the flashbacks in Katerina, they made it sound like Klaus and Katherine were actually together. Either way, Klaus is another one who coveted Elena. For nefarious reasons, but he treated her like she was special and that’s the point. He just had to “have” her. Ugh.

  2. hi.

    ~ congratulations on finding a job.

    ~ stefan was able to get in alaric’s apartment! i completely forgot about that. if damon needed an invitation then stefan would have needed one.

    ~ elena comes across as a lot less sympathetic or caring when you think about how she tries to police the people around her in a way that leaves her the center of attention and yes it’s in the name of their safety, but she has decided that she gets to make those decisions instead of say jeremy or bonnie or caroline and while the show clearly wants elena’s decisions to appear selfless (oh she must carry this on her own) they have, since the halloween episode in s1 led to countless deaths (basically every death that has occurred on this show since that episode). and i just want someone to call her on it. (i want matt in particular to call her on it but that’s because i’ve got all sorts of personal canon about how badly he actually handled vicki’s “disappearance” and death, especially since he was left to do mostly nothing after it happened)

    ~ “WOE IS US. WE HAVE TO PRETEND TO BE IN A FIGHT,” This season I’ve liked what the dynamics of their relationship mean (within their relationship) but the feelings are often hit and miss for me because they make each other myopic. They fall into this selfishness that is supposed to represent the strength of their love instead of it’s weaknesses.

    ~ stefan’s weird abandonment/guilt complex is about him enabling damon. which would be great if that was acknowledged as a part of his character, mostly negative but with positive instances, instead of always being posed as a positive aspect of their relationship. stefan’s storyline/arc this season was to be the perfect/trusting boyfriend.

    ~ what actually pisses me off the most about stefan’s lack of an arc this year and it only beginning w/klaus and whatever plans he has for him is that katherine was around for the whole season! only making snarky comments and getting stuck in rooms when, if what they wanted was to push stefan over the edge (and certainly, whatever timeline this show exists on, not a lot of time had passed between the blood!arc and the premiere) they could have had her do it. but nope.

    ~ i agree with you about stefan being stagnant this season.

    ~ i can’t get over the fact that damon killed alaric and they were friends by the end of the next episode or two.

    ~ the “you’re my friend” line was really interesting and i’ll admit that the first time i heard it i thought it was a nice line. i didn’t hate damon at the time and i was looking for any reason to be endeared to him (i was also under the impression that he would have to deal with her knowing what happened to Caroline, but I’m no longer under the impression that anyone on this show will have to deal with anything that isn’t plot related in the near or far future). but their friendship is a thing of convenience for damon. (it’s weird because damon fans use that friendship to prove that damon is more human than stefan when…damon’s relationships with humans are convenient and they are both vampires.

    ~ “well you said that katherine’s dangerous” LOL

    ~ “just let him have season three. where he’s always walking upright.” THE GREATEST!

    ~ THEY TOOK A WALK AFTER DAMON FORCE FED HER HIS BLOOD! Because Elena got over it, more or less, after a minute and Stefan is mostly just aborted rage when it comes to Damon. Because he has to be the “good” one by the show’s standards and damon can’t die because this is a show about a love triangle.

    ~ I remember being disturbed by Elena’s sarcasm when she was talking to Caroline because, like you said, Katherine is a threat to everyone. Did Stefan forget about the whole “I’ll kill everyone she loves in front of her and then kill her in front of you” line? Did that fall out of his brain?

    ~ no one is allowed to want to protect themselves or their family/friends/memories because it will interfere with the plot of the show and the desires of the main cast, specifically damon/elena/stefan whose desires are the plot. no one gets to feel anything on this show. no one gets to grow. it’s bloodless.

    ~ the fakeness of the curse seems like it would be easy to figure it out if someone actually thought about it and read it…but since the curse was only something they knew about, abstractly, instead of something they had to read, everyone believed it.

    ~ elena isn’t good at sympathy when it comes to people who aren’t damon or stefan. she also makes reckless decisions, in order for the writing to prove that she is fearless and in love and strong. i don’t hate elena , but i feel like my feelings for her are supposed to be less complicated than they are. i’m supposed to take the writing, this season, at face value.

    ~ good point about caroline not making a move when damon made a move to “kill” her mother! this season is a huge blackhole to me, except for the things that pissed me off/amused me the most. and i never thought about the fact that the girl!power of this show is largely superficial and is made that way because of the triangle and primarily the salvatore brothers, damon more than stefan, but stefan all the same.

    ~ i’m about to do a season one rewatch (in order to write matt fic) and i’m worried i won’t be able to like the characters again.

    ~ re: what you said about elena fans, instead of stans/delena fans/stelena fans; i don’t think there are a lot of elena fans left. there are a lot of stans left. and that’s okay, people are going to do what they’re going to do, but it forces one to look all over the place for a ship-lite/nonstanning read of the show.( i’m a character lover. which is part of the reason i multiship more often than i otp, so i either stop loving a character (elena and to a lesser extent stefan) or i just cling desperately to the ideas that pop into my head for characters (bonnie, jeremy, matt, etc).

    _ jeremy is actually a pretty stunning character.

    ~ “she fell down the stairs and immediately thought she’d fake her death” HILARIOUS TIMES.

    ~ Caroline is always apologizing for reasons that rarely make sense.

    ~ but that scene was about how amazing Damon is! that he wants to be human and cry about killing people because he doesn’t want to be human at all!

    On a serious note: I left a lot of episodes this season feeling manipulated.

    ~ conflict potentially means character development. real conflict potentially means something more than just everyone is on the same train and kumbayaing along or dying to get rid of them.

    ~ it’s because he’s damon and they have to. that is what the show is about.

    ~ 1) to give stefan time to take the blood out of the fridge and 2) because she wanted to say something and decided not to say something once she had the real fight with stefan

    ~ well obviously, katherine threatened unicorns. elena needs that cleared up. caroline was supposed to fight back or something. elena somehow has both the ability to be surprised by people’s desire to protect her and offended when they won’t. (this entire situation is weird when one takes into account how fast elena was to remind tyler of how they’ve been friends since they were kids and he’s not a bad guy and blah blah blah he was with her murder party up until she brought up their childhood.)

    ~ he still killed her brother, though. he still killed her brother, though. he still killed her brother, though. That’s all I could think about while watching that scene. Even with the initial feelings of “damon thinks he’s the sheriff’s friend”. so i had no idea what she was talking about. maybe because he suggested that caroline was still a human being? i don’t know. the writers think that him thinking liz is his friend is enough to excuse the whole killing her brother thing.

    ~ the intensity of the “i’m offering you my pinkie” moment actually won me over the first time.

    ~ i usually just listen to your podcasts, but i think i might watch the next episode so it’s all fresh in my brain when i listen to the podcast.

    ~ why was that car in the woods? my biggest complaint with the show is that the vampire/werewolf mythology is to wrapped up in katherine/elena/doppelgangers to actually have much meaning beyond “sometimes monsters fall in love”. i think klaus’s interest had more to do with killing (and that is where the whole “brothers torn apart over a doppelganger” parallel they’re trying to make falls apart for me because elijah’s feelings are left in this desire/admiration place and klaus’s feelings are clearly about the doppelganger as vessel or object, he’s intense about it but that’s because he wants to live).

    ~ i hope all of this makes sense. i couldn’t get to sleep so i decided to listen to this (which might sound more ridiculous than i mean it) and type a lot of wordy responses. the punctuation is probably all over the place, amongst other things.

    • Hi. Thanks!

      (i want matt in particular to call her on it but that’s because i’ve got all sorts of personal canon about how badly he actually handled vicki’s “disappearance” and death, especially since he was left to do mostly nothing after it happened)

      Ooo, I’m interested in hearing about your personal canon for Matt. I love personal canon! And Matt is probably one of the characters I wouldn’t think people made personal canon for.

      This season I’ve liked what the dynamics of their relationship mean (within their relationship)

      What do they mean?

      I completely agree on Stefan and his enabling attitude towards Damon and how Stefan couldn’t gotten an arc/storyline through Katherine.

      (i was also under the impression that he would have to deal with her knowing what happened to Caroline, but I’m no longer under the impression that anyone on this show will have to deal with anything that isn’t plot related in the near or far future). but their friendship is a thing of convenience for damon. (it’s weird because damon fans use that friendship to prove that damon is more human than stefan when…damon’s relationships with humans are convenient and they are both vampires.

      Yeah, when I first heard the line it didn’t bother me because I was under the impression that Damon would be made to own up to what he did. I’m no longer under that illusion when it comes to anything Damon does.

      I know exactly what you mean about fans hailing Damon’s friendship and how that somehow shows he’s made more connections than Damon. But the thing is Damon isn’t written as caring about any of these friendships. The friendships are all about him. We’ve already covered Liz. When Alaric got possessed, Damon didn’t care. He didn’t talk to him about it afterward. When Alaric lost Jenna, Damon didn’t care. He didn’t talk to Alaric or try to cheer him up. He talked to Elena.

      ~ the fakeness of the curse seems like it would be easy to figure it out if someone actually thought about it and read it…but since the curse was only something they knew about, abstractly, instead of something they had to read, everyone believed it.

      Yes! Why didn’t any of them ask the questions some of the fans were asking? Such as: how come the Aztecs reached across the ocean to Europe in order to create/find a doppelganger? They wouldn’t have known about Europe at that time, so why didn’t they use an Aztec woman? Just questions like that. But they just took Isobel’s Research at face value.

      (this entire situation is weird when one takes into account how fast elena was to remind tyler of how they’ve been friends since they were kids and he’s not a bad guy and blah blah blah he was with her murder party up until she brought up their childhood.)

      Oh my God, this is such a good point! She’s always written as understanding/sympathizing with the guys but the girls always have to work a little harder to earn that sympathy. The way Elena is written is so ridiculous sometimes that it’s almost funny. Smh.

      my biggest complaint with the show is that the vampire/werewolf mythology is to wrapped up in katherine/elena/doppelgangers to actually have much meaning beyond “sometimes monsters fall in love”.

      Yes! If it wasn’t just a backdrop to Elena/etc, then they would have bothered to include how the werewolves and witches feel about each other. I had hoped to learn more about the supernatural community. Instead it was same ‘ole same ‘ole vamps/weres are mortal enemies. And I just realized that with the curse being fake, we don’t know why weres and vamps hate each other.

      • Most of my Matt canon has to do with how he handles his relationships/feelings (his feelings for Elena in the middle of s1 vs the beginning of s1 and now; other than Tyler, I think he probably considers Bonnie to be his closest friend; the feelings/non-feelings he had for Caroline in s1 being wrapped up in him wanting to move on from Elena/feeling alone more than anything else; I think
        he’s quick to push people away when they disappoint him, which is a pretty simple way to put what i think of as his abandonment issues;). I’m trying to work all of this out in fic because that’s easier than talking about how he is bad at handling relationships that don’t involve his family members.

        What do they mean?

        I don’t know if they mean anything and the lack of conflict in their relationship was part of why Stefan didn’t have an arc this season, but when compared to her relationship with Damon, Elena’s relationship with Stefan involves him at least trying to play at her being equal to him when it comes to the vampire/human thing. He doesn’t always agree with her decisions and sometimes he actively works against her but he’s never outright overriding her wants and desires to serve his own. Which, to me, is great when compared to Damon’s “I’m going to protect you no matter what you actually want” (Then again, I guess it could be argued that Stefan occasionally lets Damon do that in lieu of doing it himself.) Other than the fact that the show suggests a depth to their love that is just not my cup of tea, I think they have a pretty functional relationship. The power dynamics aren’t as sketchy as Damon/Elena.

        The friendships are all about him. We’ve already covered Liz. When Alaric got possessed, Damon didn’t care. He didn’t talk to him about it afterward. When Alaric lost Jenna, Damon didn’t care. He didn’t talk to Alaric or try to cheer him up. He talked to Elena.

        how come the Aztecs reached across the ocean to Europe in order to create/find a doppelganger? They wouldn’t have known about Europe at that time, so why didn’t they use an Aztec woman?

        EXACTLY. This is where pacing would help the show a lot. It would at least make it look like the characters took the time to think about things.

        And I just realized that with the curse being fake, we don’t know why weres and vamps hate each other.

        Possibly to contribute to the Romeo and Juliet stylings of Tyler/Caroline. Or just an easy way to create conflict. Except for the whole, werewolves aren’t that scary if they don’t bite you and you have a shotgun.

        Do you think werewolves in TVD were ever able to shift at random or did Klaus make up that part as well? Because he’s able to shift whenever he wants (except for the full moon, when it’s a done deal), but are we meant to assume that he lied about other werewolves being able to do that?

        • Most of my Matt canon has to do with how he handles his relationships/feelings (his feelings for Elena in the middle of s1 vs the beginning of s1 and now; other than Tyler, I think he probably considers Bonnie to be his closest friend; the feelings/non-feelings he had for Caroline in s1 being wrapped up in him wanting to move on from Elena/feeling alone more than anything else; I think
          he’s quick to push people away when they disappoint him, which is a pretty simple way to put what i think of as his abandonment issues;). I’m trying to work all of this out in fic because that’s easier than talking about how he is bad at handling relationships that don’t involve his family members.

          This has me really looking forward to having you on the show! I’d love to talk to you more about this. Especially about Bonnie being his closest friend after Tyler. I know one other person who feel this way. It just makes sense. Without their connections to the Founders kids, neither Matt nor Bonnie would be going to things like the masquerade ball or the Founders’ party. I think they’re closer to each other on the economic level. I mean whereas Caroline made a comment about Matt getting a job and Elena would act like she gets it (of course), Bonnie is the one who would truly get it.

          (Then again, I guess it could be argued that Stefan occasionally lets Damon do that in lieu of doing it himself.)

          Yes. I agree with what you said, but this right here gives me pause, because towards the end of the season, with the help of a Fandom friend of mine, I’ve been realizing that there’s a whole can of worms when it comes to Stefan and Damon, how Stefan relates to Elena when it comes to Damon, and what that says about Stefan as a person. I feel like sometimes Damon is just so outrageously disgusting that it takes the spotlight off of Stefan’s less than stellar qualities. And I don’t mean stuff like, “He’s not perfect.” I mean stuff that can make me side-eye him. Stuff like that habit he has of trying to quiet Damon’s victims. Stuff like calling Bonnie a weapon and, even worse, treating her like one for all of season 2. Season 2 was bad for Damon in an obvious way (like all things about Damon are obvious), but it was also bad for Stefan and it’s not just because he didn’t have a storyline. It was bad for him in my eyes both because of what I saw him do and the things he didn’t do (when he should’ve).

          Except for the whole, werewolves aren’t that scary if they don’t bite you and you have a shotgun.

          And here’s where the Tyler/Caroline storyline for season 3 will start to fall apart.

          I have no idea. It would be cool if that were the case. And Tyler could start searching for how to do that. Based on season 2, we know it’s something he would want: the ability to control the change. Unfortunately it’s the VAMPIRE Diaries and the poor werewolves were just backdrops for the Elena Is In Peril plot. Geez, is that what we have to look forward to for the rest of the series. The werewolves could be so interesting. Where are the talks of Alpha wolves? Why aren’t they building the world of the weres and witches alongside the world of the vamps? We have some witch jargon like “channeling” and even less were jargon like “pack,” but where’s the rest? It’s not that they’ve run out, it’s that they don’t seem to be interested. If I have to watch someone transition into a vamp and describe the new sensations one more time….Maybe now that Klaus is a vamp, we’ll here more, but it’s bs that a freakin’ vampire had to become one in order to learn about it. What does that have to do with Tyler? Ugh.

          • I feel like sometimes Damon is just so outrageously disgusting that it takes the spotlight off of Stefan’s less than stellar qualities…Season 2 was bad for Damon in an obvious way (like all things about Damon are obvious), but it was also bad for Stefan and it’s not just because he didn’t have a storyline. It was bad for him in my eyes both because of what I saw him do and the things he didn’t do (when he should’ve).
            I agree with what you’re saying here. Stefan’s faults are often overshadowed by Damon’s faults because Damon is loud and effectual. He’s awful, but his actions have very visible effects. Stefan on the other hand is the opposite (which is something I think the writers get confused about. the two of them don’t become each other when given the chance to not drink human blood or to drink human blood, give themselves over to their true nature or what have you, they become extreme versions of themselves, at least they should, given what the show wants to say about these two vampires) so while his decisions/actions/inaction get a pass because he isn’t vile or “devil may care” direct about his wants, he got to spend a large portion of the season not doing anything about damon because damon could help him protect elena and using bonnie as a weapon because bonnie was their ultimate defense against klaus. he didn’t do anything and when he did do things they were also a part of the ends justifying the means of his inaction. which is a problem.
            They had the werewolves kidnap and torture Caroline in order to drive home just how much they needed to die. Every single werewolf who wasn’t Tyler died, which is how much they care about werewolves. I hope Klaus’s current state leads to some new information about werewolves that Tyler gets to know about. everything we know about vampires is something new vampires get to know within minutes/days/seconds of becoming vampires. Mason didn’t even get to tell Tyler anything about it. We have no clue what Jules told him about it. And Tyler is busy being a part of Caroline/Tyler, so. i want to know so much more about witches. i was so angry when greta died because how could her story have possibly been finished? she joined with a vampire in order to undo a spell that seems central to the balance witches are meant to uphold. why couldn’t we have learned more about how she came to that decision and if there are others like her and that one white warlock who died? that would be too much to expect.

          • Sorry for cutting in, but I feel like Bonnie could relate to Matt because of the absentee parental thing along with being in the non founders family club. Granted all the kids on the show are being neglected in someway, shape, or form by their parents. I do agree that Bonnie and Matt can connect better on a financial level, but I think Bonnie’s a little more well off than he is.

            What does Bonnie’s father do? Is he a doctor?

            Maybe now that Klaus is a vamp, we’ll here more, but it’s bs that a freakin’ vampire had to become one in order to learn about it. What does that have to do with Tyler? Ugh

            mmmh and doesn’t that say so much? smh

            Is it bad that I want them to bring back Elijah just because he talked about the witches?

            Don’t even get me stared on Stefan being a dick in season two.

      • Yes! If it wasn’t just a backdrop to Elena/etc, then they would have bothered to include how the werewolves and witches feel about each other. I had hoped to learn more about the supernatural community. Instead it was same ‘ole same ‘ole vamps/weres are mortal enemies. And I just realized that with the curse being fake, we don’t know why weres and vamps hate each other.

        I wanted to know how the weres and witches felt about each other too. I wish Mason could have had a reaction to Bonnie being a witch instead of him having a reaction to Caroline being a vampire.

        I think the interaction between Mason and Damon proves why vamps and Weres don’t get along.

  3. Hello, I found your podcast yesterday and just marathoned all 5 S2 episodes reviews. Your reviews are so, so, so great! Your observations are spot-on. I’m really looking forward to your review of ‘Plan B’ (aka the episode where poor Mason is tortured and murdered by a raging psychopath, ugh).

      • Hi! I marathoned them over the course of 2 days. I couldn’t stop listening because I agreed with you so much, lol. And this is such a rare thing when it comes to this fandom and how it perceives the show.

        Oh, and I guess I should put an asterik at the end of my statement about Plan B. Poor Mason is tortured/killed and the rest of the gang is apparently fine with that?! Especially Mr “I’m the good brother and feel other people’s pain” – I guess not Mason’s pain. This show!

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